The Soccer Blog: Manchester United 2 - Arsenal 0: Same Old Story as United Send Gunners Packing

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Manchester United 2 - Arsenal 0: Same Old Story as United Send Gunners Packing

Manchester United 2 – Arsenal 0: Same Old Story as United Send Gunners Packing - The Offside - Arsenal blog

« Manchester United – Arsenal Match Thread | Home | Manchester United 2 – Arsenal 0: Same Old Story as United Send Gunners PackingBy: Martin | March 12th, 2011
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Exactly two weeks ago, Arsenal fans had our chests puffed out a bit, bandying about phrases like “the quadruple” and “four wins at Wembley.” That talk was always optimistic/borderline delusional, but still, it reflected a certain boundless optimism, and was grounded in the reality that we were the only English team still alive in four competitions. Now we won’t get back to Wembley unless we buy a ticket, and we’re down to one competition. No more knockout ties, and we know exactly what the rest of our season looks like — we’ve got 10 games to save our season, or face another year of hearing “SIX years without a trophy.”

Poking around on Twitter before the match waiting for the lineups to be released, it was striking how many people were criticizing/poking fun of Manchester United’s weakened, unorthodox lineup, talking about how cynical it was and talking about “parking the bus.” For as much as we criticize Wenger and our players for not learning lessons and underestimating opponents, many of our fans are just as bad. Ferguson wasn’t about to concede a match against Arsenal and his hated rival Wenger, and the old man is crazy like a fox, and if you don’t know that by now, you obviously haven’t been paying attention to the man’s career.

We are now 0-1-6 in our last 7 matches against Manchester United. In those matches, we’ve managed a grand total of 3 goals, and haven’t managed more than 1 goal in any particular match. This despite having most of the possession in 5 of the 7 matches. The only conclusion I can come to is that Manchester United simply have us figured out. Ferguson has come up with a strategy for beating us, and it’s one that works very, very well.

They feel comfortable in the ability of their defenders to soak up our pressure and possession, and prevent us from getting good chances in and around the box. They stay tight and compact at the back, like a coiled spring. They don’t seem worried in the least about us having the ball. But when they do get the ball back, the spring uncoils — they realize that they can hit us on the counter, and they have the speed and skill to exploit the space afforded them on the counter to punish us. That’s their strategy, they understand and execute it against us, and the ugly reality is that it works like a charm. We can talk about possession or shots all we want, but the reality is that the way United set up is designed to let us have possession, and shots from outside — they’re not bothered by that in the least, whereas their possession and shots are going to count. And unless either Wenger changes strategy or our players show a bit more cutting edge in the final third, it’s going to be awfully tough for us to beat Manchester United for the foreseeable future.

Shoryuken!

We started off brightly, and were certainly on the front foot from the outset. We had possession deep in United’s half, but couldn’t manage to do much at all with it. It was a collection of misplaced passes and sloppy move in the opposition half, and while I should have been encouraged, I actually just had a sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach — to quote Yogi Berra, it just felt like deja vu all over again. How many times had we seen Arsenal start brightly against Manchester United the last few seasons, only to fail to do anything with it and get hit on the counter with a goal?

And the pit of my stomach was right. United had the first two great chances of the game. They should have made it 1-0 in the 15th minute, when Fabio sent in a beautiful cross into the center of the box, Koscielny didn’t jump for it, Gibbs let Rafael get away from him, and he basically had an open header from the edge of the six-yard box that he really should have buried. Instead, he put it over. It was a let off, but not for long.

Fabio laid the ball off to Rooney about 10 yards or so outside the 6-yard box, Rooney sent a beautiful looping pass out left to an onrunning Chicharito, who actually got off a very good header considering where he was and the direction of the ball. Almunia did well to save, but he spilled the ball out into the middle of the box, where Fabio had made his run and pounced. As I said earlier, it was so typical of the kind of goals Manchester United has scored against Arsenal the fast couple of years, and the kind of goal they wouldn’t have been able to score had it not been on the counter. 1-0, Manchester United.

van Persie created a chance from basically nothing not too long after that, when he created some space for himself and squeezed off a pretty innocuous looking shot from the edge of the box. But it was a pretty brilliant shot, just inside the far post, and forced a finger-tip save from van der Sar to concede a corner. van Persie then had a free header about 8 yards out on the near post from the resulting corner, but put his hard header well wide. Just before half-time, we had another good chance as Nasri made a very good run inside the box, and somehow managed to squeeze off a shot from a tight space — he put the shot between Wes Brown’s legs, and van der Sar was screened a bit but managed to get down and save it. That was the last action of the half, and we went into the break 1-0.

Manchester United brought on Valencia at the break to help them hold onto the lead, and it was an inspired tactical substitution that worked very well. He had been out months with a broken angle, but didn’t appear to have lost a step. We had the first good chance of the half, as Koscielny of all people broke free on a run and got through on goal, but his shot was well saved by van der Sar.

And then it happened. Rooney always scores against Arsenal and today was no exception. Rafael crossed a ball in to Chicharito, whose shot was blocked and deflected by Djourou. The shot ricocheted out wide, where Rooney was running, and he headed the ball back across goal from a very difficult angle, and the ball trickled just into the far post and bounced over the line. 2-0 Manchester United, and at that point, you just felt like Arsenal weren’t going to climb back in. And they didn’t.

Which isn’t to say we didn’t have chances. Nasri had a decent shot from the edge of the box. van Persie had a free kick from pretty much the perfect location from him that he sent directly into the wall. Chamakh had one decent shot saved, and a looping crossbar that bounced off the top of the crossbar. Chamakh had another very good header that he put into the ground, which took just enough off it than van der Sar got over to stop it off the bounce. Rosicky, of all people, sent in a very good dipping long range shot that van der Sar parried out into the middle of the box, but we couldn’t get to it before United did. And then in injury time, a beautiful cross was played in to an unmarked Rosicky on the edge of the six-yard box, and he whiffed on the shot.

But they had just as many if not more chances late on. We were pressing, which played right into the hands of their soak up pressure and counterattack strategy. Giggs had the ball up around his waste, from 5 yards out, with an open goal, before Wilshere did very well to take the ball away from him — if Giggs had just let Chicharito have at the ball, it very likely would have been 3-0. A deflected Chicharito shot was on its way over the line before Almunia managed to get a hand to it right on the line to keep it out (Djourou was injured on the play). Rooney had a hard shot saved by Almunia. Almunia made a nice point blank save from Chicharito.

We couldn’t convert the chances we had, and Manchester United never really looked anything less than comfortable. Scholes should definitely have been sent off late after a couple of shocking tackles on Chamakh and Koscielny. Both of them could have led to serious injuries. Earlier in the season, in anticipation of some anniversary, Wenger was asked at a press conference what he thought about Scholes — he said that Scholes was a tremendous player, but that he had “a dark side” to him as well. Of course, in the press this became “Wenger attackes Scholes.” But this is exactly the sort of thing he was talking about. Up 2-0 late in the match, he’s flying around two-footed trying to hurt people. Stay classy, Scholes.

And of course there are two other talking points from this. One good, and one bad. So let’s do the bad first and try to salvage a good note to end on, shall we? Djourou went down injured, and it looked serious. It was on Man United’s jailbreak counter when Almunia was forced into a tough save. Djourou went down right in front of Sagna, who was running back trying to cover. Djourou’s arm got pinned behind him by Sagna’s leg. Looked like his right shoulder got badly, badly dislocated — he had to be stretchered off and was being given oxygen. Wenger has confirmed that he is out for the season. This is bad, because with him out for a while and Vermaelen coming back God knows when, that leaves us with Koscielny and Squillaci, and only Alex Song and Ignasi Miquel to back up. Which is scary.

Okay, then — the good news. Aaron Ramsey is back. He came on as a sub, and looked okay. It’s been nearly 13 months since he last played for Arsenal. As I’ve said before, I don’t think we should really expect too much from him this year — the next two months will be more about getting make to match fitness and getting re-acclimated to the pace and quality of the league so he can go into preseason training next year on equal footing with everyone else in a position to fight for a position in the starting XI. But it was great to see him back out there. Especially if Song has to be pulled back to the backline, I do think Ramsey may see a fair few minutes over the next couple of months.

So we’ve got 10 matches to sort out our season. The silver lining may be that we only have 10 matches left, while Manchester United have their league matches plus matches in the Champions League and the FA Cup, so they’ll have to deal with a lot more fixture congestion, fatigue, injuries, and so forth than we will. But this theory of things hasn’t really been borne out by Arsenal in recent years — we have a tendency to see our league form go right down the crapper as soon as we go out of the other competitions. It may be down to a lack of confidence or something else, but it will be interesting to see if we can reverse that trend this year. Here’s hoping.

Rough loss, but let’s enjoy the rest of our weekends. For as bad as things are right now, we’ve got a match against West Brom next weekend that can draw us even with Manchester United atop the league. It’s still all to play for, they’ve got to come play us at the Emirates, and we’re still very much alive in the league race.

On to the player ratings:

Almunia 7.5 Hard to blame him for any of this. Maybe should have parried Chicharito’s shot in another direction on the first goal, but made up for it as the game went on with a number of very good saves.

Sagna 7 Weird match for Sagna. Offensively, I thought he was excellent today. Provided a constant attacking threat and sent several inch-perfect crosses in. If he played for a different team he could have had 3 or 4 assists today. But Fabio absolutely terrorized us down that flank today.

Gibbs 6 Did okay going forward, but didn’t help us out very much defensively.

Djourou 7 Very solid defensively, really provided a lot of stability to our backline. He’s been our best defender and one of our best players, period, for much of the season, and his loss is a massive blow to our title hopes.

Koscielny 5.5 Continued to show a good attacking instinct that has arrived seemingly out of nowhere in the last few weeks, but defensively he had a rough day. Didn’t follow Fabio’s run on the first goal, definitely would have been at fault for the goal had Rafael’s header been better, and caught out of position a couple of other times, as well. He’ll really need to step up now that Djourou is out if we’re to have any hopes of winning the league.

Wilshere 8 Man of the Match. All-action, head up, never gave up. As I said after the Barca match, give me 10 more like him and we’ll never lose a match. It’s just a shame we don’t, and that a 19 year-old in his first year with the team has to be the one that sets the example.

Denilson 5 Got caught jogging back on Manchester United’s counters, exactly as he had done multiple other times in his Arsenal career. Other than that, it was a lot jogging and around and passing backwards.

Diaby 6 I thought he was pretty crappy, and responsible for being the dead end of a number of Arsenal moves into enemy territory and other giveaways. In a way it’s not his fault, though — his game has always been more effective making runs from deep and drawing defenders to him and then being able to lay it off into the space that creates — when he has to play in a more advanced role when he’s surrounded by defenders at all times, his weaknesses are exposed.

Nasri 7.5 Probably the best of our attacking players, getting forward and trying to make something happen. I liked it that he got in Scholes’s face after the bad tackle on Koscielny, as well.

Arshavin 5.5 He played? Was almost entirely anonymous.

van Persie 6.5 Largely starved of service, but tried to make things happen when given the opportunity.

Chamakh 6 Is carving out a little bit of a niche for himself as an impact sub. Had a couple of excellent header chances — one off the cross-bar and another saved by van der Sar.

Ramsey 6 Very decent appearance considering the circumstances — kept up with the game and had a few bright moments. Interesting to see where he stands in the pecking order the rest of the season, as Diaby and Denilson are both a bit short of form at the moment. He may end up getting some minutes.

Rosicky 6 Took one very decent long-range shot and ran around, but was largely anonymous and ineffective.

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Category: Arsenal News, Fixtures, Manchester United, Premiership

Tags: Arsenal News, Fixtures, Manchester United, Premiership
Tweet « Manchester United – Arsenal Match Thread | Home | Alex PresidioScholes definitely has a dark side. You can see it in his eyes whenever there's a close up on him - freaking scary as hell.

Love the rating of Denilson: slow jogging and passing backwards, haha!

Is it me or is Ramsey a little taller now?RyanJHey Guys, Everyone has interesting comments. However, no one has really discussed the real problem here, our team philosophy and tactics. The person who comes up with this philosophy is our dear Arse Wenger. The guy is brilliant I must admit. The fact that he was able to initiate and build a youth system coveted by all the world is indeed a marvelous accomplishment. However, in my mind Arse has failed to evolve with the game of football. It is no coincidence that teams like Man U, Chelsea, and now lower teams, hold or beat us simply because we approach each and every game with the same strategy. This strategy is pass, pass, pass, pass, pass, and pass....better yet, see if you can pass the ball into the goal. This is indeed attractive to watch when done right, but is this strategy effective at this point? A resounding NO. It seems to me that everyone has caught on that if they crowd the box, or the latter third, crowd the mid-field and steal possession, or better yet, catch us out on the counter, they have a great change of beating us. Before we struggled against physical teams, but now we struggle against teams that outsmart us. When you start to outsmart the "Professor" that means the professor is either getting too old, or the professors philosophy isn't as special as it use to be, or is simply common knowledge. Therefore, to make it simple, there is a problem with the professor. He needs to open his mind to change to take the club in a different direction, if he is unable or unwilling to do so, I think he should be asked to step aside. I know to many of us, Arse is synonymous with Arsenal, but this is much bigger than one individual. This is a club, an organization, a team. I admire Arse for the infrastructure that he laid, but the only reason we compete in any competition is to win, and we have failed to win anything over the last 6 years. To make matter worse, even Spurs (fuck faces), are catching up to us. One word, "Unacceptable."
To take this is a different direction. There are a number of things we can say we've learned this season so far. We've learned that we need a designated leader with a backbone. Cesc isn't it. We need someone who can rally the troops and uplift us when we're down. We've learned that we have players who will never mature to what we expect or play to the level we desire i.e Denilson, Diaby, Rosicky, Arshavin, Scillachi, no name a few. If we don't inject some new blood into a demoralized team, a team that have gotten used to losing, then we're in big trouble. When I say new blood, I'm not referring to players like Kos, Scillachi, cause to be honest they both suck ass. Lets hope Man U slip up and we win most of the rest of our games so we can at least win the league. ARSENAL FOR LIFEWolffysorry man Wenger is Arsenal, and I fear for the day he leaves, as it will represent an end of an era and the end of us fans seeing some of the greatest football on the planet. The reason I became an Arsenal fan is because of how we win, not just because we win. Arsenal football club represents class and to be a fan of this football club you have to support the montra "Victory in Harmony". While it may be frustrating at times, we have to understand what being a fan of this football club means, that we will support our beliefs in this game no matter what and continue to strive in that direction.

I look at teams like Chelsea and Man United, without envy. Yes I would like to win trophies, but at what cost? Would I sacrifice my beliefs as a fan just to taste victory, no because that victory would always be less then what it could have been and in my heart I would know this.

Arsene is the only person I would trust managing this club as long as he is willing to do the job. In Arsene I trust and in Arsene we should all trust.

Vitoria Concordia Crescit!!!!!

JonathanIt always was going to be a tough couple of weeks. Birmingham wounded us at cc final Barcelona knocked us down in nou camp and man u kicked us on the ground, metaphorically speaking. It was a tough ask to play in old trafford after the huge disappointment. Fabregas playing through injury hasn't helped. Man u never saw the real gunners today. Everyones disappointed but keep the faith gunners!arn00bChelsea fan here. I was rooting for Arsenal, but it was very hard to watch as the players, with a few exceptions, showed no interest in winning. Most players were walking around the pitch instead of running.

Arsenal's passing and possession is impressive, but not as much as you make it seem. What's the point of passing it to your teammates feet while he's standing 2 meters away from you. That's all they did, they made easy passes all game long and a lot of them, until all of Arsenal, including Almunia, Wenger, Walcott and I think maybe Overmars were in the opposition box, trying to pass it into the net from inches wide.

There were very few through-balls or passes ahead of the players. Counterattacks were non-existent, Arsenal would take possession in their own box, hold possession and wait for all the Arsenal players to advance (at walking pace) while all of United have time to regain ground.

You only need one player to score, why do the counters need to involve EVERY SINGLE player?

When United are committed to the attack and lose the ball, why don't Arsenal counter? Why do they take the attack at a fast pace? There were players making runs expecting through-balls, and Arsenal just pass it back to the midfield.

Arsenal need to watch Germany's world cup goals and learn. PASS IT IN FRONT OF THE RUNNER PLAYING, NOT TO HIS FEET WITH HIS BACK TO THE DEFENSE.

It's really frustrating how you guys handed SAF this game. There was no competition. Even if you had Drogba on the bench and David Luiz in defense, the passing and style were horrendous.

This style is not similar to Barca. Barca players actually run, that Dirty Alves guy is always sweating, he's always running. Barca play through balls between defenders, Arsenal did nothing but make, short, safe passes with their backs to the goal. All. Game. Long.Patoux21It's because many players catched the Arshavin's virusarn00bIt's weird that you say that, since he used to run a lot during his first season. It felt as if he's caught the Arsenal virus. I hope you guys win the league, but if you keep walking and making those stupid passes to players feet, then it'll be another year of whiskeyface.KxevinI think that Wenger should start with new physios, and go from there. Under Frank Rijkaard, every year, Messi would have a significant muscular injury that kept him out for a while, as would other players. Those injuries would never come at convenient times.

When Guardiola assumed the reins, part of his proposal was to completely change the way the physios operated, and to start thinking about diet, preventive maintenance and other things such as player-specific strengthening programs, to reduce the frequency and severity of injuries. We're really seeing the benefits of that program.

Arsenal have bad injuries at key times, and they're often muscular, which I don't think is attributable to bad luck as the terrible Djourou injury was today. Every club has those kinds of injuries, but it seems to me from the outside that Arsenal have more of the "preventable" type. And over the long haul, they derail a championship-potential season. If Fabregas and Van Persie are 100% for the Camp Nou (Walcott was just bad luck/tackle-related), that's potentially a different result.

Anyhow, it seems to me that Wenger has 95% of what you need in place. You're close. Very close, but club health is crucial to trophies. Thoughts?GigiGood thoughts.
I gave my impressions in the previous post so I wont be saying it again. (basically not winning the league with all the games and injuries math)

I agree with almost everything except Arsha's rate, I d give him a little more since I saw him run down and get in good posistions (and shoot?) at least iun the 1st half )I must confess that for the 1st time in a loooot of years I turned it off after the 2nd goal).

Well here we are again, suffering and praying.

I love AW but he is missing some facts and its costing us titles. Yeah, we are a top, elite club ten or I dont know how many years finishing top 4 and in UCL, and in semis finnals and quarter finals....well I d trade all that (except for the UCL positions) for just one trophy....any trophy (dont say Emirates cup or I d dislike you), And i d even trade all for one like the UCL trophy,

Need. More. Players.
Need. Players.High . Level.
Need. To. Sell. Mediocre. Players.
Need. Plan. For . Games.
Need . Study. Opponents
Need. Plan B. When. Figured. Out.

I Just read the goonerholic post and was also fine, for those who ned a......moral boost/ lift up/ whatever.Ajits not gonna happen under wenger, and while wenger is making your directors rich he wont be replaced either.Gigiyep, its kind of a fact, like the fact that, as is, we wont win the league.
The directors as business men should know, that if your product aint good, the masses wont buy it, and in the long (or short?) run...there will be no income.
Basic business.ASDFTotally agree with you Gigi. I dont know when (if ever) the directors would start putting pressure on Wenger to start winning trophies. I dont think there is any pressure on him otherwise he would have stopped being such a jackass and start accepting the faults in his methods. I dont recall any interview of Wenger where he has said that this loss was a tactical mistake on my part, I take responsibility. He should take a leaf out of Cesc's book and stop being so adamant. I hate him for this attitude.Homey_MillsI keep reading a lot about how Wenger should change tactics. But I'm not really sure what else we're supposed to do. We're set up to play this way. We've been playing the same style for years. We play a similar style to Barca, only our players aren't as good as theirs. But the point is that Barca seems to be able to beat teams with that style and those tactics.
I dunno... for me, I look at Chamakh's header not having enough force, and being well saved. I look at Rosicky totally whiffing in front of net. I look at RvP's shot being touched away, and then missing a header on the corner. If one of those goes in, it's a different game. There were a few other chances as well. And I have to say that Edwin VDS was world class today too. So I don't think we need to re-invent the wheel here. Just hopefully get Cesc, Walcott, and Song back at some point, and get after it again. I'm on record that we need better players at some positions, but I dunno what to do about tactics.AjI wouldnt be pig headed and say you play similar style to barca because you dont. against barca you played more like inter if i remember except even inter with 10 men had more heart and more shots on goal, you dont chase the ball when you lose it is one reason why youll never be barca, refusal to buy quality is another reason. Barca have quality throughout the team and play a beautiful as well as a pressing game.Gigijust curious, you dont sound as a gooner, whos yor team?J___VFunny how in our games against Birmingham Sunderland & now man utd the keepers keep getting MOM. could have done with that van deer sar fumble against Liverpool or one of fosters many errors this year....never seems to happen in our favour though.Patoux21The simple reason why we are not as successful as Barca is because we don't have the same quality in the team. He can be efficient when you have Fabregas, Wilshere, Nasri, Walcott and RvP on the pitch wiht Song covering but instead you Arshavin, Denilson and Diaby it's a different story. No womder our greatest spell of success was all the players I mentioned were playing at the same time. But Wenger is so stubborn he believes that with any given player he could play the same style successfully.

Homey_MillsPatoux21, I think we're saying the same thing. Looking ahead, I'd love to bring in Hazard, from what I've heard and seen of him. And I could think of several to offload. But that's getting ahead of ourselves for now. We still can take the league if we get it together.Patoux21I think we have to be prepared to see Fabregas leaving at the end of the season to take over Xavi who is aging. If I had the choice I would keep Fab, sell Arshavin and replace him by Hazard anytime. I would also try to find a player that could fill Song role to add more defensive strengh to the team. And a right back to give Sagna some competition and could force him to improve his crossing and be a bit more clever.AjI doubt if barca want him now after that poor performance against them, they will certainly not pay 50million.J___VPersonally I'd be quite happy to see fabregas go. Ramsey and jack will make for a stronger more consistent pairing. I want diaby to prove his worth but he lacks the drive to fulfil his potential so reluctantly I'd let him go or give him a major kick up the arse & one more season. Denilson has a nice story behind him and again I want him to succeed but he's gone backwards for too many years now. He's far more effective when pushing forward believing in himself but doesn't do that anymore. Rosicky is a shadow of his former self & arshavin will always run more cold than hot.

There's no reason we can't win the league from this position. I think we will but to a large degree it will be by default. Either way next year we need to be better.FelegyI don't know, with our recent difficulty scoring goals the lineup did not really make that much sense to me today. Are we ever going to see RvP and Chamakh start a game together? It seems like having both out there gives us a few more ways to create scoring chances.tinomuvonga mThere were as least two games this season in which RvP and Chamakh both started. Chamakh as the striker and RvP in Cesc's role. It just didn't work. Placing RvP out wide might be an option but if Nasri and Walcott are fit, I can't see it happening.J___VNext year I'd like to see Walcott pair with RVP. It's time!Felegyi think we all would like to see that. they just have to actually both be healthy at the same time for an extended period of time for that to happen.FelegyYeah but Walcott isnt fit right now. Doesn't having Rvp and nasri playing out wide with Chamakh as the striker give us a wider array of scoring options? RvP plays in some nice crosses that Chamakh could take advantage of, as does Nasri. I mean, who even took on the "cesc role" today? Nobody really. Maybe it makes more sense to change things a little when Fabregas is out, since he is the only one that can really play his role!Alex PresidioIs it safe to say that Walcott is pretty much out for the season? By the time he's match-fit he'll play about 2 games then get injured and be out for months.Patoux21I completely disagree with Sagna's rating. When you are right back you need to find balance between defense and offense but your first duty is to cover your side and I've seen him most of the game in ManU half than actually protecting our 2 full backs. Because he was constanly running forward ahead of Nasri, not only did he left us vulnerable on counter attacks but his offensive contribution is usually at best average. Not only his delivery is clumsy (I will remember for a long time his unchallenged 7 or 8 crosses in the first half against Sunderland where none of them reached a Gunner) apart in this game when he made 2 decents crosses in the second half but his constant positioning far of the right side doesn't give Nasri the room or opportunity to make his skiiled rush that we see sometimes when he gets past a few defender. Sagna is good defensively when he's remaining in defense but on offense he should be less predictable or run late from behind to surprise the opposition.FelegyMan, what a bummer. What really bothers me is that the team seemed to play with very little passion and urgency today. We seemed so flat! They honestly did not look like they wanted to win this game as badly as the ManU players, which makes me a little sick to say.

Denilson once again showed why he is so disliked by the Arsenal faithful bringing next to nothing positive to the game. Even the announcers seemed to be mocking him "another backward pass by Denilson".

Argh!!! I wish these losses didn't bother me so much. Since the game; I went on a multi-mile run with my dog (who is now comatose) and cleaned my entire place from top to bottom just to blow off steam and I'm still fuming and bitter. Is Wenger going to do anything to address the lack of scoring from our side lately against decent competition!!?? We all know what the definition of crazy is right.....?tinomuvonga mOld Rednose isn't the only one using this tactic. Chelsea has essentially done the same to us in the last few seasons. It would seem to me that their tactics work because we commit a lot of bodies forward. If Manure is content to let us have the ball, do we need expose ourselves on the counter in search of a goal?

I'd have to say Rednose has lot of balls though, because if we score first, he has bunch of defenders trying to get back in the game. Rednose's cowardly tactic will not work forever.

Am I the only who doesn't think it's not the end of the world when we lose away to Manure at OT?

I am fairly confident we will not lose at home to them. The 'onetuple' is on!Sairax"Am I the only who doesn't think it's not the end of the world when we lose away to Manure at OT?"

I guess to be fair, OT is a bit of a fortress. Last game they lost was last Feb(?) to Chelsea. Before that I don't even know but it must have been a while. Still, you'd think we could take it to them more than we have been.Darren_VGibbs was awful today. He was at fault for Fabio's first header that he should've scored from, and the 2nd goal, he got skinned badly to allow the original shot. Has his injuries got up with him already? I hope he finds some form again.
Almunia did well, which is a nice plus. Hope it can continue.
I didn't think Denilson played that poor a game. Mad some nice tackles, and we all know by now he has no creativity in his game, so to expect more out of him is alittle unfair.
Diaby.... meh. I hope we sell him, I am tired of him. Not a bad player, but not good enough imo. If he happens to ever clue in somewhere else, I would be pleasantly surprised.
Arshavin looks like a man who has lost all his pace and quickness. There seems to be no burst from him to get seperation from a defender anymore. Ever since Russia failed to qualify for the World Cup....

Anyone know who are longest standing players are on the first team? Cesc, RVP, Clichy, Denilson and Diaby is what I can think of. I was thinking today that it's getting time to move along the 2nd string players that have been around for awhile as they seem not to be able to cut it. After the 1st team, the rest all seem ordinary. Not bad players, but just not there.

Oh, and cannot wait for Pedro Bethelo to come to Arsenal. And others with pace upfront. Without Walcott to get behind the defense, all the players are too similar, and easy to play against.FelegyReally!? Denilson not that poor!? I almost swore on the replay of the second goal that he was standing there pointing at Rafael as he drove into the box instead of closing him down! Gibbs was at fault on that goal as well but Denilson needs to do more defensively than just point to a guy blowing by him :)
Also, if we all know that he has no creativity why was he put in there with Wilshere and Diaby. Exactly who in that group of three is going to play the ball forward?tinomuvonga mLast year there were quite a few voices out there that were clamoring for us to offload Clichy and promote Gibbs and have Traore as the backup. I am glad those folks don't play any part in the decision making at Arsenal. Gibbs is great in the final thread, maybe even better than Clichy, but the main responsibility if the fullback is to defend first. There my friends is where Clichy is much better than Gibbs. The only game this season I recall Gibbs doing really well on the defensive end would be Carling Cup against the Spuds. That's just not going to cut it. Traore can run fast and that's about it. I remember one game last year where he decided that he would not cross the ball...

I also agree that Denilson was okay. I find it strange that he gets a lower grade than those more directly responsible for the goals.

I can't imagine Wenger selling Diaby. I think he believes in him.FelegyClichy can't hold the line to save his life. 9 times out of 10 he is the guy keeping the opposition onside it seems.tinomuvonga mVery true, but I'd still prefer Clichy. It's shame Gibbs was injured last year, because he really could have stepped up his game when Clichy was injured.SK3 KO in completions in just 2 weeks. shit man. and 2 of them this week. frustration frustration frustrationHomey_MillsOverall I agree with the rankings. Probably too kind to Gibbs though. He was very much to blame for his play on the 2nd goal. And he had another awful giveaway really early that nearly led to a goal. I certainly feel Clichy is the better option. I hope he's ok.
Also, I may have missed it in the match thread, but why was Bendtner left off the bench?Patoux21Clichy is not good either. Many times strikers were onside because he didn't coordinate with others or was too slow going forward. And he has the bad habit of rushing into players in the midfield or center with very little success and leaving the side completely free. Dani Alves had a highway on the right side and was playing at will during the CL game.tinomuvonga mBendner is ill.

I also agree that the review/rank was a little generous for GibbsWolffyCouldn't agree more about the passage discussing how United have us figured out. I sat at the bar thinking about this in my head while I watched the game and it was like you were able to take my thoughts and put them into words. United just lets us have the ball, keeps good shape, doesn't over pursue, and absorbs our pressure. They know we are not able to play around them when they are behind the ball or find away through their defense. Once we finally do give up the ball, they quickly outlet it to a forward player and try to spring on the counter. It is a simple strategy that leaves us and more surprisingly Wenger, completely dumbfounded.

I too questioned Ferguson starting the game with 7 defenders, but it was genius, he knew what he was going to do and executed it too perfection. It was the most frustrating thing to watch, because I came to the realization that we have no answer to this strategy, and as a soccer fan who loves free flowing possession play, and thinks it should be rewarded with goals and victory, it only made me all the more angry.

Additionally, I am disgusted at the fact that Ferguson knows and is self assured about his strategy when facing Arsenal. I can only see him thinking, "Oh, what a joke Arsenal is, I have them completely figured out, no worries about playing at the Emirates, the strategy is simple just let them play around with the ball like a bunch of amateurs during a keep away drill (which is pretty much what our possession might as well be since it never amounts to anything when playing United), and when they lose the ball quickly boot it up the field it the typical English Footballing fashion and catch them on the break because they have been sucked up the field playing keep away."

IT MAKES ME SICK AND UTTERLY PISSED OFF.

Honestly, how could Wenger let Ferguson out class him like this. I love Wenger and I love Arsenal, but this is almost to much to bear. As a fan I realize the season is not over, but this game and the manner in which we lost it really does highlight our team, and i think foreshadow (and as much as I hate to say it) another trophy-less year.J___VThe worse thing is that whilst his strategy works everytime, it's reliance is based upon on us not being able to shoot well from the edge of the box. They still don't deny us good opportunities which lower league sides would execute better. If this is a genuine strategy then I suppose the guy really is taking the piss out of us.WolffyVery true. I think the two main components that allow Fergie's strategy to work is the lack of incisive passes we make in the final third and our overall play in the final third of the pitch, as well as our poor shooting and unwillingness to get on the end of crosses put into the box.

Cesc helps when he is healthy by making that incisive pass that breaks United's defense. Notice how he has not featured in the two most recent United fixtures for Arsenal and both results have been similar Arsenal displays, both games resulted in a loss and there really was no one who could make that final pass to break down the defense. (I know Cesc played in the first game as a sub, but was definitely still suffering from a hamstring problem, should not have played, and barely strung two passes together)

Hopefully, this means that when we face United again at the Emirates, Cesc will be healthy and able to break down their shape. Because as of right now Wenger has no one who can effectively play the Cesc role when we play against United. This has been all to clear in these last two games and just highlights how important a healthy Cesc Farbregas is to Arsenal and our playing style.

BERTRANDWe played way better today than against Barcelona.

Although, obviously that was with half of Man Utd's midfield missing. And Man Utd isn't Barca even with their first 11 all on the pitch.SairaxIt hurts.ASDFEven though MU have more games to play now as compared to us but they have much better cover than us for most positions. Our B team can lose against some league 2 team on their current form.
I also wonder why Wenger is not going for some subtle changes in our attacking play? The passing play for building up games is very pleasing to the eye, but when players like Cesc, Song and Theo are out we are not able to pick out players from short passes in the final third. Why dont we try some long balls and try releasing Arshavin or RVP for some one on one with goalies? Believing in your goal scoring and passing skills is one thing, but not making strategic changes is pure foolishness. I think our manager himself has hit a mental block here and is trying to force players to play "beautiful football". I love that interplay Mr. Wenger, but you know what I like more...seeing Arsenal lift trophies.GigiTotally agree, sometimes theres some dirty work...and somebodys gotta do it or elseJ___VWe definitely should be more aware of opportunities to mix our game up with long through balls. We've got plenty of guys capable but too often appear yo have preset ideas rather than playing the situation on it's merits.Altonmark28what a disgrace the only players who showed balls where wilshire and denilson denny worked his socks off diarby arshavin ss18 ma1 lf21 just not good enough wenger you can bang on about all the passin we need big players rolfes, can anyone imagine what adams would be sayin if he was still playin for christ sake a feel safer with the old regard with them playin now at all there ages
GrammarTry as I might, I can't understand one word you've written.HUH??lol.....hahahahahahahaMarioAlways Pretenders never Contenders.Alex PresidioIt hurt to hear but people at the bar I was at were telling me how Arsenal were nearly men but will always be the nearly-men. Get it? Gotta admit it was kinda funny. And sad. Mostly sad...Homey_MillsCouple of quick thoughts...
First, I think this is game should pretty well keep the Gibbs fans quiet. I'd definitely prefer Clichy at the moment. Gibbs was maybe the worse Arsenal player today.
Second, I'm not sure what to make of our lack of success against Man Utd. Watching the game, I never felt like they were better than us. Whereas watching against Barca, I thought they were 5 times better than us. So it's weird that we don't have the results. But still, at least we were enjoying some possession and getting some shots on goal. I feel good about our chances when we play them again, strangely enough.
Third, referees like this are the reason why so many players get injured, in my humble view. Both teams had several bad tackles. Especially players like Rooney and Scholes. A couple yellows in the earlier part of the game would have set a better tone. Now, I'm not saying we lost due to the ref. But just saying it needs to be better.JGIt's Manchester United. Ref was no Bussaca, but what do we expect, a reasonable and logical refereeing performance when playing at Old Trafford? What are we, loonies?ASDFDude pls for once stop this continuous blabbering about referees, we getting bad decisions, we would have won trophies had it not been that all referees are against us etc etc. Referring is bad for all teams and bad decisions are a part of football these days. Yet there are teams who are winning, staying at the top of their leagues, winning finals. Our team has some really obvious fallies and we better suck it up and accept it rather than ranting about refereeing decisions.NicoSigh, 3 titles lost and the PL will be gone soon enough. This all comes down to Wenger being cheap. He could of bought a world class defender and keeper in the summer, but no he buys a bunch of kids who disappear under pressure situation. We all know neither Seaman or Lehmann would have spilled that shot.J___VDon't be ridiculous. His arm was out stretched. How could he possibly spill what couldn't be caught. The most any keeper can do is parry that shot & regardless of Martin suggesting he could have pushed it elsewhere well no....you can only turn it roughly in the direction your diving.Ajtheres a reason why almunia is a backup goalkeeper to a debutant unkown szel. wenger doesnt trust him so why should the fans.J___VI've got no problem with him. He gets a raw deal not getting much credit when deserved & ridiculed for making mistakes I see each week from other keepers which go unspoken. He's not great but better than most people make out, which is why I stand up for him.TfyoungTwo thoughts.
Diaby/Denilson just not good enough. Up against O'Shea and Gibson they should have been totally dominant.
Ferguson outwitted Wenger again. Before the game anybody could have predicted that MU's game plan would have been to crowd midfield concede possession and hope to catch Arsenal on the break.....
Of course just knowing that doesn't mean I have an answer but surely Wenger knew it too.Illinois GoonerI have to agree about Diaby/Denilson. You can't deny that they have some talent and have been good for us in the past, but they have been given way too much time to prove themselves and have failed constantly. Neither one of them offers anything to the team.

Denilson is decent at keeping possession and intercepting play, but is always caught out and has brings no attacking threat. Get rid of him for an actual defensive midfielder to cover for Song.

Diaby is good at running at the defense but he has no finishing ability. He is a constant dead end when it comes to attack and he is a poor defender. He doesn't fit into our current system and is too much of a liability to keep around.Patoux21To be honest I don't see Arsenal winning against ManU even at the Emirates. How many wins in the last 11 games vs ManU just 1 win and 3 draws I think.reddevil"But this is exactly the sort of thing he was talking about. Up 2-0 late in the match, he’s flying around two-footed trying to hurt people. Stay classy, Scholes."

Yeah...this is about a guy that has more medals than all of Arsenal combined and is well respected/liked by pretty much every player out there. If Arsenal had a player like him, you wouldn't have crashed out of three competitions in a span of a week.MartinLook, I respect him, and he's a great player. And I won't even argue that we could use a player like him. I would say the last player we had in that vein was Vieira, and there's probably a reason we haven't won anything since Paddy left.

But you're frakking delusional if you honestly believe Paul Scholes is well-liked by all his opponents with his history of dirty tackles.reddevilFair enough. I really think he was stupid today (and it'll come bite us later as he's banned and Fletcher is injured leaving us with...Gibson) but to say that he goes in with the intention of hurting someone is pushing it, imo. He's not like, say Shawcross. And, I can't for the life of me remember a time Paul Scholes injured anyone.

His tackling isn't the best, and I'm pretty sure most/all United fans would agree about that, but I don't think he's dirty. Or, anti-football as your manager wants to call it.PlykabIt's tough to analyse an individual like Scholes when you are a fan of United. His spirit is incredibly important to your team, and of course you're going to see him in the best light. As basically a non-fan of the EPL teams (i like the EPL, but not a fan of any particular team), i can tell you what my judgement of Scholes is:

A player that every team loves to have but hates to play against. He is essential for great teams. But to say that he isn't dirty, that he doesn't attempt to hurt people, etc., is pretty ridiculous. He is as dirty as they come, right up there with Gattuso.Homey_MillsI was hoping there wouldn't be Man Utd trolls, since their page on the offside is virtually non-existent.mattwe'd have to whine about the referee and "injustices" to bring the traffic of delusional sycophants up on par w/ your crowd.

martin's got it right, then comments like yours "OH THE REF" smack of entitlement...which is the main problem at your club and with your fans. you've got to go take wins away from other teams not expect them.Homey_Mills"we'd have to whine about the referee and "injustices" to bring the traffic of delusional sycophants up on par w/ your crowd."

Or, you know, have writers like the Martin and Sairax. That would help too.

And am I missing something, or do Ferguson and his players never complain about the refs?
SairaxNo, he insults referees and then goes on Mugabe Media Lockdown.Djr90125If we finish third I'll show my A--e! at the Emirates. Perennial bottlers!

RawsyMarkodonavanwe have abetter run inMarkodonavankeep the faith league not over yetblog comments powered by Disqus